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Post by Dulciana on Dec 7, 2006 23:48:01 GMT
I should have done that weeks ago, but I didn't. I think it would look like I was rubbing it in now.
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Post by Steve Hopwood on Dec 7, 2006 23:56:30 GMT
I have a fair few failures to my name. They all followed the same pattern: claimed wanted to do the exam; did not do the work required; failed. The only way to avoid this is to insist that candidates are ready to take the exam before entering. The difficulties here are two-fold: candidates will be well past their ideal performance moment by the time they take the; most candidates will not even get to the entry stage, as it is the looming exam that persuades most of them that it is time to do some work. ;D Actually, there is a third way - the Steve way. People have to practically beg to be allowed to do an exam - the older I get the more I hate them. Perhaps we should be treating exams as things taken by those rare few able to work towards them properly and benefit from the exercise, rather than meaningless tests taken at regular intervals by any clot able to waggle their fingers vaguely in the direction of the keyboard?
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Post by Dulciana on Dec 8, 2006 0:02:56 GMT
Yep, you've got a point! But I seem to be blessed with with quite a few who only switch on properly when it's for an exam. So that's the route we take. But I misjudged it badly this time!!
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Post by Dulciana on Dec 8, 2006 0:10:14 GMT
A question, Steve! When a pupil doesn't do exams, or hardly ever, at what stage do you decide to put a piece to bed? That's something I'm never sure about! Do you still try to get things to performance level, or do you move on before that? At what point is there nothing more to be gained?
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Post by Steve Hopwood on Dec 8, 2006 7:49:27 GMT
A question, Steve! When a pupil doesn't do exams, or hardly ever, at what stage do you decide to put a piece to bed? That's something I'm never sure about! Do you still try to get things to performance level, or do you move on before that? At what point is there nothing more to be gained? It seems to me that pupils will only attain performance levels if their is a performance to prepare for. I like preparing cooperative students for exams. The right mix of quickly learned general repertoire and deeply studied material prepared for assessment helps people learn most effectively. I find that insights gained from the deeper study of exam material remain in place during later rep study. The people who urine me off are those who indicate a desire to take an exam but then have to be dragged kicking and screaming through the work required. There are obvious ways of avoiding this, but I like to get pre grade 6 exams done and dusted within the quarter in which they are taken. Learning the material coincides with entry, so people are committed to taking the exam before they have finished learning the pieces they have chosen. I am not in a position to say, "Ok, let me know when you have stopped mucking around and learned these pieces and I will consider entering your." Hey ho. I cannot have everything. To answer your actual question rather than rambling around the houses, I like pupils to move quickly through the repertoire. Years ago, I surmised that keeping kids interested was the most important thing I could do and evolved my method by adhering to this basic principle, so: Beginners: I judge how much material to give them by how much we can get through in a 30 minute lesson; I figure they can practise that during the week even though few of them will actually practise for 30 minutes a day. I only make them do pieces for a second week if: something has confused them to the extent they have failed with it and sorting out the confusion will benefit them; they really like a piece. Pre-grade 6: once pupils reach the stage of tackling, say, Wedgewood's Up-Grade book 1, I like to work on a two week cycle until they are post grade 5 standard. Week 1 - start a new piece. Week 2 - polish the old piece and start a new one. This is a headlong dash through material, so an occasional 'catch-up week' spent on the same two pieces is necessary, then the whole process begins again. Post grade 5: everything depends on the individual student but even here I will not make them spend more than a month on a piece - longer than this and boredom sets in. The length of the piece has considerable bearing on the length of time I let them spend on it. There are exceptions to everything I have written earlier. The post-grade 8 lady who would cheerfully an entire year on the same piece, if I let her, is a great example. ;D I am not saying everybody should work this way. It is what I do.
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Post by caz on Dec 8, 2006 11:21:56 GMT
Yep, you've got a point! But I seem to be blessed with with quite a few who only switch on properly when it's for an exam. So that's the route we take. But I misjudged it badly this time!! Just to say Patricia, that it is not a case of you misjudging it badly, more a case of him not doing what he claimed he would do - you shouldn't feel bad about it. My adult Grade 3 failed this term - it wasn't pleasant to have to tell her - she is one who just loses it due to nerves. I'm not sure if I will do anymore exams with her.
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Post by caz on Dec 8, 2006 11:34:28 GMT
once pupils reach the stage of tackling, say, Wedgewood's Up-Grade book 1, I like to work on a two week cycle until they are post grade 5 standard. Week 1 - start a new piece. Week 2 - polish the old piece and start a new one. This is a headlong dash through material, so an occasional 'catch-up week' spent on the same two pieces is necessary, then the whole process begins again. This is similar to what I do - which is why you kind of need the exam process occasionally, to stop and learn something properly with all the necessary phrasing, nuances etc. Unless you use festivals for that purpose instead I suppose.
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Post by chocolatedog on Dec 8, 2006 12:46:49 GMT
yup - I find exams slow everything down, as you spend maybe 3 months or so on the same pieces getting them as good as possible. Again like Steve I tend to try to avoid them if I can, as pupils can get through so much more repertoire without - and fun stuff too, without having to learn goodness knows how many scales.......Pupils have to generally ask to do an exam, although I sometimes ask them at the beginning of a term what they would like to do - if they want to think about an exam or if they'd rather just do lots of new pieces - and most of them plump for the latter......even with this I'll occasionally ask them to memorize the piece they're playing which obviously means them knowing it even better before we leave it.......
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Post by anacrusis on Dec 8, 2006 15:18:35 GMT
It seems to me that pupils will only attain performance levels if their is a performance to prepare for. I like preparing cooperative students for exams. The right mix of quickly learned general repertoire and deeply studied material prepared for assessment helps people learn most effectively. I find that insights gained from the deeper study of exam material remain in place during later rep study. Oh, this soooo rings a bell! I'm currently doing the rep extension bit, and nothing, but nothing is at or anywhere near performance level....keep hoping it could be if it needed to be. CDs idea of memorising would have me sprinting for the exit - still can't do it for toffee. Dulciana - seriously, you've done your bit, you can't do more, and since he said he wanted to do the exam, so be it. Maybe it'll learn him. Or maybe he'll pull off a miracle - if it weren't uncharitable of me, I'd rather be wanting to hope he wouldn't, or he could get smug.
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Post by kflute on Dec 8, 2006 16:32:04 GMT
I've had the odd student fail..............as in occasional not strange!!! I had an adult pupil fail grade 8 at Easter. This time last year I said I didn't think she should do it and that she wasn't good enough, but she insisted. She could've scraped a pass if she'd worked hard enough. What she didn't tell me when I entered her was that she had to go to China for the whole of the February with work!!!!!!!!!!!!! She failed, and she was very upset. I did warn her quite clearly, but she was adamant, and in the end of the day, she was a grown adult with her own mind and spending her own money. If it was a child in this situation, I wouldn't have entered them.
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Post by princessmoose on Dec 8, 2006 18:08:23 GMT
I think I'll have a few fails in my first sesion . They all need a kick up the bum.
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Post by YetAnotherKlavierist on Dec 8, 2006 18:39:28 GMT
I guess you're not allowed to kick them up the bum yourself nowadays, so maybe an exam failure is the only option.
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Post by Dulciana on Dec 9, 2006 10:36:50 GMT
I'm having trouble adding a long(ish) post to this so am going to see if two short ones work. Apologies if you're reading this and it seems incomplete!
Having read about everyone else's approach, I'm wondering if I'm too much of a perfectionist! Not with regard to thinking the pass standard for exams is higher than it is, but with regard to perfecting things generally.
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Post by Dulciana on Dec 9, 2006 10:44:44 GMT
(See above!) While I'm not averse to the odd wrong note, I really don't like to see pupils leave something till they've made a reasonable stab at the phrasing, dynamics and articulation. For the first term we do fun things, then stuff for a Christmas concert, and in January we get well stuck into exam repertoire.
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Post by Dulciana on Dec 9, 2006 10:53:30 GMT
(see above - sorry!)
We also do what I call "quick studies", which is pieces which are easier than their grade, where I don't look for perfection, but I expect them to be half-reasonable in about three weeks. After about Grade 5 I'd worry about a pupil never perfecting anything to exam standard, as I'd wonder, "Can they?"
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